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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi,

Well, I have yet another issue with my 2009 Enclave. It's throwing a code for the Bank 1 catalytic converter (code 420). Was quoted roughly $1000 CND for parts, labour and taxes. The part itself is around $575.

I have around 103600 km on the vehicle, should the cat converter be failing already? I did have coil/misfiring issues earlier this year, and was told (by the dealer) I couldn't damage the car further (took a few days for the parts). Got that fixed. Could that have contributed to this issue? Could I cause further damage by not repairing right away?

Even though it's fun to drive, I would now never recommend an Enclave to anyone. I bought the Enclave in Jan of this year, and I've had nothing but problems with it. Must have spent close to $4000 on it for repairs. I am also turned off by GM, won't buy another GM vehicle. I owned a Cavalier for 14 yrs before the Enclave.

Does anyone know where I could buy a cat converter cheaper? The dealership looked up warranties for my vehicle, and the cat converter was covered, but that expired in July of this year.

What a headache this Enclave has been! :angryfire:
 

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Driving with a misfire for a while can damage a CAT. The dealer should have checked the CAT when he replaced the coil and replaced the CAT at that time under warranty - I assume you were still under the emissions warranty. In fact you may still be since it is an eight year And I believe 80K mile warranty.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
JerseyDevil said:
Driving with a misfire for a while can damage a CAT. The dealer should have checked the CAT when he replaced the coil and replaced the CAT at that time under warranty - I assume you were still under the emissions warranty. In fact you may still be since it is an eight year And I believe 80K mile warranty.
the warranty for the cat converter ran out in july of this year.
 

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usually- manuals say-- if the CEL is FLASHING--- STOP-- do not drive...
as it may damage Emissions devices (---->CATs)


and if its lit ON- OK to drive but get it looked at soon.
 

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That is one repair that could spell the end for a vehicle due to cost. My 1998 Nissan is on the original CAT. imho one no-no is to continue to drive with faulty o2 sensors.

Back in 1998, Nissan was like GM is today, doing a FED and Calif. version of emissions. My car has Calif. emissions, and even rockauto likely cannot help. If the y-pipe and CAT were to fail, it would likely spell the end of the vehicle due to cost. My former friend's 2006 Passat 3.6 4Motion needed catalyst, and she junked the car, it's simply too expensive.

I don't even want to know what it would cost on my BMW with 4 CATS.

Common sense says a CAT failure on a 2009 Enclave is not the end, if it's $1k, imho that's ok. But should it fail at 65k? No way. People in Calif. are protected against these shenanigans by law, too bad it's not all states.
 

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But should it fail at 65k? No way. People in Calif. are protected against these shenanigans by law, too bad it's not all states.

So driving a car with the CEL and a mis-fire which may be dumping raw gas into the converter is considered shenanigans, and should be outlawed by law? What was the history of this used car purchased earlier this year?

The failed converter mentioned here is from an owner who purchased the car used this year. He was also driving around with a mis-fire and didn't mention for how long before going to a dealership about it. Doesn't take much raw fuel to ruin the converter.

The owner is also from Canada, so he would have a different emission warranty than the US Federal Warranty perhaps.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
not sure if there were any cat failures prior to my purchase.

i drove with the misfire for about 1.5 weeks...again, the dealer told me there's nothing to worry about.

would this be a suitable replacement? It is the cat converter near the firewall, which is what I need:

http://getyourparts.ca/?product=buick-enclave-3-6l-v6-rear-firewall-side-unit

btw, the CEL is now off? I can't recall if they reset it when they scanned, but later driving home (after work) I noticed it was gone. If they reset it, how long before it comes back on?

Also, I was told I can drive the vehicle with the cat converter code and not further damage anything. true?
 

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DriveAround said:
not sure if there were any cat failures prior to my purchase.

i drove with the misfire for about 1.5 weeks...again, the dealer told me there's nothing to worry about.

would this be a suitable replacement? It is the cat converter near the firewall, which is what I need:

http://getyourparts.ca/?product=buick-enclave-3-6l-v6-rear-firewall-side-unit

btw, the CEL is now off? I can't recall if they reset it when they scanned, but later driving home (after work) I noticed it was gone. If they reset it, how long before it comes back on?

Also, I was told I can drive the vehicle with the cat converter code and not further damage anything. true?
Curious....was there a CEL when the misfire was happening? If there weren't, and the dealer told you nothing to worry about, then you did absolutely nothing wrong, it's not like we scan our vehicles for shadow codes daily.

If there were a CEL, and the dealer told you it's ok, then they will probably say you shouldn't have driven with the CEL.

If they told you to ignore, and reset it, and it didn't come back, then it's on them...

Again, there shouldn't be anything that would set off a CEL at such a low mileage, but that's an ideal world I suppose....
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
CEL was definitely on for the misfire...

you say 'it's on them', but really, what can i do? They have provided me with great customer service, i'd feel like a d... if i went back and said it was their fault....but is that something i should do? not sure where to go from here.
 

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DriveAround said:
CEL was definitely on for the misfire...

you say 'it's on them', but really, what can i do? They have provided me with great customer service, i'd feel like a d... if i went back and said it was their fault....but is that something i should do? not sure where to go from here.
See, I don't know how a dealership can tell you to ignore the lamp. If they turned it off, and it was gone, and then they told you you're good, you don't know any better.

But they are blatantly telling you yes, there is a CEL, you're ok to ignore it. Then, it's on you...

Meaning say your temp were high, and the dealer told you to ignore the overheat condition. Then the heads are cooked....

It's simply unprofessional to have told you that. Incompetent too. If they need to be the bearer of bad news, so be it. They should not tell people to ignore warnings.

In the end $1000 is at stake, not the end of the world...problem is if the root cause of the misfire still exists, it could ruin a new CAT...
 

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DriveAround said:
To find the root cause would a complete diagnostics find it?

thanks for your help!
They should have pulled the codes while the lamp was lit....I look at it like a computer....it tries to store everything when possible, but you can yank the power cord and crash it, and not everything will be there (analogy). I know with BMW, things can get reset by turning off the motor, and restarting it. There should be shadow codes upon doing so, but still (they are still there and can be read--I have seen some using my laptop/software--pretty cool, records mileage, rpms, etc. when it happened), the shops prefer to be able to plug in when the SES is lit up.

So you may end up having to pay the $1,000, but you should make sure there is not something still wrong that would ruin a new CAT....sorry to see you're having all these issues at such a low mileage, all we can really say is, "it is what it is." Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks again for all your input, it has helped me.

Just wondering why my CEL has not come back on by now ??? Could it have been a CEL issue, where there isn't really a problem but it came on?
 

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There should be some historical codes. A good OBDII reader should be able to pull up any past codes.
Another reason the light has cleared is that after so many starts, the problem that was there but went away causing the light would go out.
Had the same thing on my Rendezvous, someone else drove it for a couple days and the light came on, O2 sensor low voltage, I drove it for a couple days and the light went out. For me I believe it is the drive style that makes the difference.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
well, yesterday my CEL came back on. I would like to get it scanned to see if it is the 420 cat converter issue again.

any suggestions, like should I ignore it for a few days to see if it goes off again? It was off for around a month (but now back on).

Thanks!
 

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Are you the only driver of the car?
Could be different driving styles, yet getting the codes read will help to narrow down the problem.
If you live in the States I understand a place like Autozone will read the codes for free.
Rick
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
i am the only driver.

Well, now the CEL is off?! It didn't come on when I started my car to go home yesterday. So it was on for around 24 hrs.

usually i take it out for lunch, short trips. i didn't yesterday, it sat in the parking lot all day. not sure that would affect anything, but it was different from what I usually do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
the CEL came on yesterday evening driving home from work.

Today at lunch it was out again. Would a cat converter issue cause the CEL to come on, then off for a while?
 

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DriveAround said:
the CEL came on yesterday evening driving home from work.

Today at lunch it was out again. Would a cat converter issue cause the CEL to come on, then off for a while?
I have the same issue with my 09 it has 140k on the clock and I've been chasing the 420 code. No rhyme or reason to it. o2 sensors seem ok temps are identical on both cats. I'm wondering if it's a lean condition causing it. We need a really good GM tech that experienced this issue and I bet it's a simple fix. My research showed a guy replacing both o2 sensors on bank 1 the cat and the fuel injectors and cleaned the map sensor and still had issue. I'm wondering if it could have something to do with carbon buildup on the valves. Please update if you find the problem and I will do the same Thanks.
 
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