your fine. dealerships use glass companies to install glass. i think even OEM glass is made by one of the "other" manufacturers anyway.buick67 said:
windshield replacement
We just had our windshield on our 08 Enclave replaced. I asked that original equipment be used and they told me they would do an direct replacement. I assumed that direct replacement would mean OEM. When I picked up the car the windshield has a ppp soundmaster solargreen laminated acoustic. Since I know little about glass, did I get the same quality replacement as OEM?
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Your original windshield has a square in the lower passenger side with GM inside the square.
If it doesn't have this it is not a GM windshield, but all replacement windshields have to meet OEM standards.
If it doesn't have this it is not a GM windshield, but all replacement windshields have to meet OEM standards.
The fact the replacement doesn't have a GM logo is largely irrelevant, as is the fact it didn't come from GM.buick67 said:We just had our windshield on our 08 Enclave replaced. I asked that original equipment be used and they told me they would do an direct replacement. I assumed that direct replacement would mean OEM. When I picked up the car the windshield has a ppp soundmaster solargreen laminated acoustic. Since I know little about glass, did I get the same quality replacement as OEM?
By definition, there would be no GM-related identification for any windshield sold in the aftermarket. While I understand the point you're trying to make about wanting a "direct replacement", keep in mind your local shop isn't getting the replacement glass from GM; he's getting it from the manufacturer of the glass itself which, in this case, is PPG.....which is likely GM's OEM source for the glass anyway.
I'm about 99% sure you have glass which is not only comparable to that from the factory, it's quite likely the exact same glass. And, if GM happened to have sourced their factory glass on the Enclave from somebody other than PPG, I think you should be completely comfortable that the new windshield meets every spec of the factory glass.
PPG (Pittsburgh Plate Glass) has been making windshields forever and are as good or better then factory installed.
Thank you for all of your replies. It is much appreciated.
I just got the same PPG SoundMASTER windshield. I was assured the PPG is truly OEM. I am very happy with the quality.
Another discussion here with picture of windshield label:
http://www.enclaveforum.net/index.php?topic=4078.msg
Another discussion here with picture of windshield label:
http://www.enclaveforum.net/index.php?topic=4078.msg
I searched for this topic as I just discovered a pitting on our windshield. Since it's in the center, no action needed, just wanted to know the scoop just in case. We have a $100 deductible, unfortunately, don't live in a state where glass is a free replacement. Anyone get new glass recently?
I can tell you my experience with BMW and OEM. The lizard co. will do everything to discourage a windshield replacement, and then, if you do elect to replace (why would you not if you have something in driver's view in which case you would fail inspection?), they discourage 1) OEM 2) Premium glass and encourage 3) aftermarket
Cost: 1>2>3
I don't see any reason to not get OEM, unless the policy specifically states that aftermarket is what the policy provides. You're paying the deductible anyway, why wouldn't you not want the best product?
Of course there is GM OEM glass:
Gm
08-12 $538.24
$538 may not seem to sound like a lot, but I can tell you it's more than BMW OEM glass which has a rain sensor. So insurance would of course rather put in a $180 windshield rather than $538. That's the part alone. With labor the markup should be well into the mid 700's. Whereas with aftermarket the entire job is probably done for $230.
How do you tell? OEM looks exactly like what came with the car. On a BMW, it would say Saint-Gobain Sekurit "with" a BMW logo. If it were premium glass, it would say Saint-Gobain Sekurit without a BMW logo. If it were aftermarket, it may say safeco etc. and have a logo on the wrong side of the glass.
I can also tell you the safeco did not fit my car, the tech could not get it installed. That was not the case with my Nissan which has a safeco windshield. My hunch is that the ppg in this thread is premium glass, but it is not OEM. When it's time for our glass to be replaced, I'm going to insist the windshield logo is the same as what's coming out. Based on my new insurance, I may or may not be able to pull that off. Now we have insurance with the hands, it's anybody's guess. But the lizard did end up paying for OEM BMW in the end.
I can tell you my experience with BMW and OEM. The lizard co. will do everything to discourage a windshield replacement, and then, if you do elect to replace (why would you not if you have something in driver's view in which case you would fail inspection?), they discourage 1) OEM 2) Premium glass and encourage 3) aftermarket
Cost: 1>2>3
I don't see any reason to not get OEM, unless the policy specifically states that aftermarket is what the policy provides. You're paying the deductible anyway, why wouldn't you not want the best product?
Of course there is GM OEM glass:
Gm
08-12 $538.24
$538 may not seem to sound like a lot, but I can tell you it's more than BMW OEM glass which has a rain sensor. So insurance would of course rather put in a $180 windshield rather than $538. That's the part alone. With labor the markup should be well into the mid 700's. Whereas with aftermarket the entire job is probably done for $230.
How do you tell? OEM looks exactly like what came with the car. On a BMW, it would say Saint-Gobain Sekurit "with" a BMW logo. If it were premium glass, it would say Saint-Gobain Sekurit without a BMW logo. If it were aftermarket, it may say safeco etc. and have a logo on the wrong side of the glass.
I can also tell you the safeco did not fit my car, the tech could not get it installed. That was not the case with my Nissan which has a safeco windshield. My hunch is that the ppg in this thread is premium glass, but it is not OEM. When it's time for our glass to be replaced, I'm going to insist the windshield logo is the same as what's coming out. Based on my new insurance, I may or may not be able to pull that off. Now we have insurance with the hands, it's anybody's guess. But the lizard did end up paying for OEM BMW in the end.
All Buick Enclaves come with special sound-proof glass all around. The windshield is not a "$199 special" from glass pro.
As I mentioned above, try to get the PPG SoundMASTER windshield. I was assured the PPG is truly OEM from a regional GM dealer-option installer. The facility only handles GM products. They told me you cannot buy glass with a GM stamp. Only the factory glass gets the "GM" stamp. PPG makes the glass in the factory. PPG makes the OEM.This was a $700-$800 deal. For a $100 deductable I say go for it.
Trivia. Automobile safety design engineers use the strength of a windshield as a factor in whether your roof will collapse in a rollover accident. A replacement windshield which is not properly installed can "pop out" when a rollover occurs if the glue on the edge is not applied correctly. For example (as I saw on a 20/20 investigation years ago), simple hand skin oil can cause the windshield glue to fail (gloves should be worn.)
As I mentioned above, try to get the PPG SoundMASTER windshield. I was assured the PPG is truly OEM from a regional GM dealer-option installer. The facility only handles GM products. They told me you cannot buy glass with a GM stamp. Only the factory glass gets the "GM" stamp. PPG makes the glass in the factory. PPG makes the OEM.This was a $700-$800 deal. For a $100 deductable I say go for it.
Trivia. Automobile safety design engineers use the strength of a windshield as a factor in whether your roof will collapse in a rollover accident. A replacement windshield which is not properly installed can "pop out" when a rollover occurs if the glue on the edge is not applied correctly. For example (as I saw on a 20/20 investigation years ago), simple hand skin oil can cause the windshield glue to fail (gloves should be worn.)
I always thought PPG stood for Pittsburg Paint(s) and Glass?gmf101 said:PPG (Pittsburgh Plate Glass) has been making windshields forever and are as good or better then factory installed.
EDIT: I am wrong, it's PPG Industries....but it used to be Pittsburgh Plate Glass. Learn something new every day.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPG_Industries
Guess you hear it wrong from one person back in the 80's and that sticks....I had a friend who's dad worked for PPG, perhaps they were saying it wrong?
I hear what you're saying. Saint-Gobain Sekurit makes the windshields for BMWs. One has a BMW logo--it is OEM. One does not have a BMW logo, it is aftermarket. Due to its pricetag (and supposed name), it is considered premium glass. The two are not identical. OEM costs more. The only person who shouldn't want an OEM replacement, is the insurance co.
Again, I believe it's the same in the GM world. GM logo = OEM. If PPG makes it, so be it, then put one in with the GM logo if insurance allows it. I'm not saying we can always beat big insurance, because we can't. But at least we can try. To say you cannot buy a windshield with a GM stamp, why not? If you have money, you can buy anything you want. It's $538.24 list.
My goodness, people who are really into cars need everything to match up. Not having an original windshield is pretty obvious when the logo says ppg, safeco, pilkington, etc. With a GM logo it's anybody's guess if it's original, or not.
Again, I believe it's the same in the GM world. GM logo = OEM. If PPG makes it, so be it, then put one in with the GM logo if insurance allows it. I'm not saying we can always beat big insurance, because we can't. But at least we can try. To say you cannot buy a windshield with a GM stamp, why not? If you have money, you can buy anything you want. It's $538.24 list.
My goodness, people who are really into cars need everything to match up. Not having an original windshield is pretty obvious when the logo says ppg, safeco, pilkington, etc. With a GM logo it's anybody's guess if it's original, or not.
Because GM-branded windshields are manufactured with original GM Computer-Aided Design (CAD) data, they meet stringent manufacturer quality standards. In addition, GM-branded windshields match the shape, tint, thickness, and noise-reduction properties of the original. This preserves windshield wiper and heating/air conditioning performance, and reduces the chance for wind noise and water leaks. And remember: if it doesn't have the GM logo, it's not a GM.
http://www.mycertifiedservice.com/PartsAccessories/replacement-windshield.jsp
http://www.mycertifiedservice.com/PartsAccessories/replacement-windshield.jsp
Well, if memory serves me correctly, GM vehicles used to have the PPG logo on the windows, I think in the 80's, thru the 90's? PPG had some tie to GM, because my friend's dad (when I was growing up, sometime in the early 80's) started driving only GM vehicles when he worked for them, before that he was driving Fords because of some tie to them with that job. :shrug: Again, I was a kid, so some of this information might be off a little, but I have a pretty good "car stuff memory", so I bet this is pretty close to correct.john 070 said:I hear what you're saying. Saint-Gobain Sekurit makes the windshields for BMWs. One has a BMW logo--it is OEM. One does not have a BMW logo, it is aftermarket. Due to its pricetag (and supposed name), it is considered premium glass. The two are not identical. OEM costs more. The only person who shouldn't want an OEM replacement, is the insurance co.
Again, I believe it's the same in the GM world. GM logo = OEM. If PPG makes it, so be it, then put one in with the GM logo if insurance allows it. I'm not saying we can always beat big insurance, because we can't. But at least we can try. To say you cannot buy a windshield with a GM stamp, why not? If you have money, you can buy anything you want. It's $538.24 list.
My goodness, people who are really into cars need everything to match up. Not having an original windshield is pretty obvious when the logo says ppg, safeco, pilkington, etc. With a GM logo it's anybody's guess if it's original, or not.
You are probably correct. PPG may very well be the supplier and mfg. the OEM glass. The fact is that logo, be it BMW or GM, adds hundreds to the cost of the glass, and it's what came with the car. Again, from experience in the BMW world, with the logo is OEM, without the logo is "premium aftermarket." Safeco is aftermarket. The thing I'm trying to stress is that in the pecking order, the glass with the logo on it is OEM, costs the most, and is what came with the car. The one without the logo is not OEM, it isn't what came with the car, it costs less, and it can even be made by the supplier who makes the OEM. But it isn't OEM, it's either "premium" aftermarket, or aftermarket. It is not identical as some would like to claim. The installer wants to make the most profit he can, and that's not happening on the one with the GM logo. He can't just get it anywhere, he has to get it from someone who is marking it up. That's his motivation from steering you away from it, or if he can, tell you that it doesn't exist.
Why would Safeco want to sell you aftermarket, netting the lowest price, when compared with OEM? They work with insurance cos. (you schedule right from the insurance cos. web portal), and they have the highest margin on safeco glass. When they install OEM, they may colllect $750 from you, but the mfg. and distributor pocket the profits, not safeco. They would rather you pay them $230 for their glass.
But when you pay $0, or $100 deductible, what glass do you want? The one that costs $700+ out-of-pocket, or the one that costs $230 out-of-pocket?
These shenanigans go on all day long with auto parts, can you buy a "new" brake caliper, or a "new" alternator, or "new" a/c compressor? Insurance cos. and people who contract with them will tell you no, aftermarket is just as good.
When it's time for a new windshield, I'll try my best to get the GM logo (insurance may resist, I dunno, I have that hands co. now not the lizard). If I have to settle for PPG which is what I think is premium aftermarket, maybe that's the reality. But when aftermarket didn't fit, the lizard co. paid for the BMW OEM with logo on my 335. Maybe it'll be the same with the Enclave....
Why would Safeco want to sell you aftermarket, netting the lowest price, when compared with OEM? They work with insurance cos. (you schedule right from the insurance cos. web portal), and they have the highest margin on safeco glass. When they install OEM, they may colllect $750 from you, but the mfg. and distributor pocket the profits, not safeco. They would rather you pay them $230 for their glass.
But when you pay $0, or $100 deductible, what glass do you want? The one that costs $700+ out-of-pocket, or the one that costs $230 out-of-pocket?
These shenanigans go on all day long with auto parts, can you buy a "new" brake caliper, or a "new" alternator, or "new" a/c compressor? Insurance cos. and people who contract with them will tell you no, aftermarket is just as good.
When it's time for a new windshield, I'll try my best to get the GM logo (insurance may resist, I dunno, I have that hands co. now not the lizard). If I have to settle for PPG which is what I think is premium aftermarket, maybe that's the reality. But when aftermarket didn't fit, the lizard co. paid for the BMW OEM with logo on my 335. Maybe it'll be the same with the Enclave....
About 6 weeks ago I had a hawk divebomb into our windshield, needless to say I had to have it replaced. :beer:
The hawk or the windshield? ;D
We got a windshield ding in our 2013 Enclave, in the bottom/outside passenger area. Its small and about the size of a nickel. My wife had it repaired at Guardian. They put a "sealer" on it. It is still visible, but not bothersome. I've had this done a lot on the past and the repair was always an epoxy that made the ding/star almost completely disappear. Are any of you familiar with the "sealer" approach?
I read this thread with interest regarding the replacement vs. OEM windshields. Any more recent thoughts? Given the Buick Quiet Sense (or whatever they call it) technology, who sources replacement windshields these days? Does one have to have this done at a dealership or would the usual 3rd parties (Guardian, Safelite, etc.) do just as well.
I read this thread with interest regarding the replacement vs. OEM windshields. Any more recent thoughts? Given the Buick Quiet Sense (or whatever they call it) technology, who sources replacement windshields these days? Does one have to have this done at a dealership or would the usual 3rd parties (Guardian, Safelite, etc.) do just as well.
Our Enclave hit a rock recently. I'm going through the "expected insurance channels" to get it replaced; Their vendor Safelite was all set to install a replacement. I pointed out that the offered replacement was not equivalent to the GM windshield in any respect and therefore would not accept it. Currently Buick is using PGW to supply to their specs. Don't know if that is same as PPG or LOG??? Additionally the GM windshield is DOT rated 904; ASI M405; specifically "ACOUSTIC". SAFELITE'S offered did not meet any of those specs. It was stamped with an ICON that the rep said was acoustic but he could not show me anything that confirmed that.
Safelite said they would get me a GM windshield. We shall see.
It is your money; keep your eyes open and do your research.
Safelite said they would get me a GM windshield. We shall see.
It is your money; keep your eyes open and do your research.
Good luck,and thanks for the information and warning on replacement windshields. Please chime in with the results.redclave11 said:Our Enclave hit a rock recently. I'm going through the "expected insurance channels" to get it replaced; Their vendor Safelite was all set to install a replacement. I pointed out that the offered replacement was not equivalent to the GM windshield in any respect and therefore would not accept it. Currently Buick is using PGW to supply to their specs. Don't know if that is same as PPG or LOG??? Additionally the GM windshield is DOT rated 904; ASI M405; specifically "ACOUSTIC". SAFELITE'S offered did not meet any of those specs. It was stamped with an ICON that the rep said was acoustic but he could not show me anything that confirmed that.
Safelite said they would get me a GM windshield. We shall see.
It is your money; keep your eyes open and do your research.
Also, :welcome: to the forum.
What I've found is the Safelite is just as good is something made up by the insurance industry, and Safelite. Tell the story enough times, and people start believing it.
If my deductible is $100, then a $800 windshield, or a $300 windshield, costs me $100. Who has to pay more for the $800 windshield? The insurance co.
Years ago, with the lizard insurance co., I had to argue for 40 min. with this claims rep, to get a Saint Gobain Sekurit OEM BMW windshield with rain sensor. Sure enough, that took a small chip last year.
I went to safelite to see about a repair, and finally, someone who was honest. He said if I owned your car, I would not do anything. The chip is so small, we'd have to enlarge it, to repair it. Plus, you have an OEM windshield--I would wait for further damage before touching it. Because your insurance co. will likely not want to pay for an OEM, and have us install one of ours, which I wouldn't want, if I owned your car.
He told me the chip would not go anywhere, and 10 mos. later, he was right.
If my deductible is $100, then a $800 windshield, or a $300 windshield, costs me $100. Who has to pay more for the $800 windshield? The insurance co.
Years ago, with the lizard insurance co., I had to argue for 40 min. with this claims rep, to get a Saint Gobain Sekurit OEM BMW windshield with rain sensor. Sure enough, that took a small chip last year.
I went to safelite to see about a repair, and finally, someone who was honest. He said if I owned your car, I would not do anything. The chip is so small, we'd have to enlarge it, to repair it. Plus, you have an OEM windshield--I would wait for further damage before touching it. Because your insurance co. will likely not want to pay for an OEM, and have us install one of ours, which I wouldn't want, if I owned your car.
He told me the chip would not go anywhere, and 10 mos. later, he was right.
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